Finding Peace in Grief with Tanya Kimball

In this episode, we sit down with Tanya Kimball. Over the last 18 months, Tanya has navigated the unimaginable loss of her husband, Drew, and two of her sons, Braden and Grahm.

This conversation isn't just about tragedy; it’s a masterclass in the "paradigm of two truths" how extreme sorrow and extreme miracles can exist in the same moment. Tanya shares her raw experience with "dying without death," the power of recording daily "evidence of God," and how the temple became her survival-grade "modern-day Liahona."

In this episode, you’ll learn:

• The "Silent Saturday" Perspective: Understanding the gap between the "Friday" of crucifixion/loss and the "Sunday" of resurrection/promises.
• Mental Health Stewardship: Why asking your child "What is your biggest worry?" can be a life-saving intervention.
• The God of Compensation: How Tanya identifies miracles and "heart rocks" amidst devastating grief.
• Recruiting an Army of Angels: The literal power of family history and temple work in providing strength to those still on earth.
• The "I Freaking Love You" Legacy: How a simple phrase from Tanya’s husband became a movement of connection and validation.

We know that the topics of grief, suicide, and mental health are heavy, and we hope Tanya’s story provided a beacon of light for whatever "Saturday" you might be walking through.

We Want to Hear From You!

Our mission is to share stories that bridge the gap between our earthly struggles and our eternal potential. If this episode touched you, or if you know someone with a powerful testimony of faith, resilience, and temple worship:

• Comment below with your suggestions for future guests you’d like to see on the show.
• Share this episode with a friend who might need to hear that they are "freaking loved" today.
• Subscribe so you never miss these essential conversations.

We’ll see you next week, but until then, keep looking for your own "evidence of miracles."

Transcript

A Tender Introduction

SPEAKER_00 0:05

It was my great gift to speak to Tanya Kimball, a dear filmy friend of ours, who's lost her husband and two children in the last year and a half. Today's episode, she's going to teach us about grief and gratitude, about those early days of loss and what challenges and overcoming obstacles look like. She's going to talk a lot about the temple and the savior. I don't know how to really introduce this episode properly, other than to say that when she left, I had a different perspective on life that actually made me happier in the face of all that tragedy that she shared. So please be mindful of today's episode. The topics we're covering today are tender. We're talking about suicide. We're talking about depression, anxiety. We're talking about a lot of things that we as parents need to be aware of as we're raising our kids. This is probably the most important episode I've ever filmed. And it is a great privilege that I get to introduce Tanya to you. So, what was it like for you, like today, coming down here and thinking about this podcast? Like I'm just curious more personally, like what that's been like for you.

SPEAKER_02 1:05

Um, I think that, well, it's been on my mind a lot. I actually took a weekend last weekend to go to California and just kind of like, what has my journey been like? You know, and have some time of reflection. Um, you know, I'm speaking in a couple of places and I'm just like, what is it that I need to share? And what is it? I want to be inspired to say what, you know, people, people like me need. Because when I was in my position early on, I was like, please tell me what to do. It's you just feel so like foreign and out-of-body experiences and numb. And you're just trying to find like fumble your way through life at that moment, you know, and you're just willing to like absorb anything. And and really those people who had experiences like who were a little ahead of me were the ones that really like helped pick me up and kind of like helped me get through a lot of that.

SPEAKER_00 1:58

Okay, so very interesting. So that was a grounding thing for your experience, was having people who've also had loss and grieving. And so talking you through that was comforting.

SPEAKER_02 2:07

Yeah, very comforting, you know. You just feel like out of your realm of yourself, you know.

SPEAKER_00 2:15

Yeah, you said it best. There was a when we were talking, you said something about how I'll get the word wrong, so please tell me how to say it. But it's like you don't lose someone without dying yourself.

unknown 2:25

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 2:26

What was it?

Dying Without Death

SPEAKER_02 2:26

What was the phrase you said? Okay, now I gotta remember, but it's um, have you ever experienced dying without death? And that for me is it really like resounded in my heart because I was like, Yes, I have died without death. A piece of me died, you know, when Drew and Graham and Braden all died. That that was it opened it. So many people in death associate before death and after death. Like they are different. That it's changed them. And um for sure that is I have experienced a death of sorts, you know, without dying.

SPEAKER_00 3:07

And degrees of that as well.

SPEAKER_02 3:09

And degrees of that.

SPEAKER_00 3:10

So in in so you've been thinking about what you're going to say to people as you're talking on stages or wherever that is. What's come to mind for you? Like what are some of the topics that have come to you?

SPEAKER_02 3:21

I mean, it's impossible to share my story without faith. You know, that is like the biggest thing. I have experienced heaven, a front seat to heaven, you know, in a lot of ways. Um, I believe in a God of compensation, you know, and I think that bad things happen to good people, but also God compensates in a lot of ways. And um, I have experienced miracle upon miracle upon miracle of, you know, compensations and evidences, evidences of God's love for me, God's awareness of me, of my family. And um, you know, I think that I hate the quote um everything happens for a reason, you know. I hate that. So many people say that, you know, and I think that their intentions are good, you know, they mean well by saying that, you know, and and really generally there's saying like bad things happen to good people sometimes and it stings. But um, I love the quote that God will make reason in everything and and he will find reason in everything. And I think that that's more important is that we see that this life is a struggle, and he knows that and he knows how hard it is, and that even in that, it's a perfect plan. He's going to make reason out of everything, and he's gonna continue loving us and being there in the messy, in the hard. He's not waiting for us at the end of a finish line, you know, at you know, eternity or whatever it is. And he's in the thick of it and he does he never leaves us. It's up to us to kind of keep turning to him and choosing him and wanting to see all of those evidences that he puts in front of us.

SPEAKER_00 5:06

So what were what were the circumstances that people are hearing about that are you're talking about in terms of losing Drew? What happened in those cases?

Brayden’s Story And Mental Health

SPEAKER_02 5:15

So um, December of 2024, we lost Braden to suicide. He was 17 and um just devastated us. You know, it was kind of unexpected. Um and just I think so many people are struggling with mental health. A lot of high performance kids, um people excelling, knowing, feeling that expectation to excel. Um, athletes, academics, all the things, right?

SPEAKER_00 5:45

It doesn't look like one thing.

SPEAKER_02 5:47

It doesn't. It depression to me, it totally shifted after I lost Braden, you know? Um and so yeah, I learned a lot about how we all feel that, how normal that feels sometimes, and how we just need to keep going, getting through it, and finding help and reaching out to people when we feel those things, right? Um but yeah, it shifted our entire lives. Um one of the things that Drew often talked about was ask your kid what their biggest worry is. Sometimes it's uncomfortable to have those conversations. It's uncomfortable for us as parents, um, and it's uncomfortable for the kids, but it's life-changing. You know, it could change a life, it could save a life. And knowing what your biggest worry, that your child's biggest worry, or your um adult child, you know, or asking a friend, family member what their biggest worry is, that's it's a way to open the door into maybe something more tender and and real and honest and vulnerable. Um but after Braden passed away, our home got very real. We started having really honest and open conversations. Um, we talked about hard things, we discussed what our feelings, you know, and a lot more than we ever had. And it totally shifted our home.

Hard Conversations With Kids

SPEAKER_00 7:07

This is such an important topic, if I can, you know, just take a beat on this, because um, mental health has has just deteriorated across the country, and everyone knows this, but the stats are staggering. Since 2014, for young girls, suicide rates have tripled. Every hundred minutes, a young man or young woman takes his or her life. Um, anxiety and depression are clinically diagnosed in one out of three teenagers and suspected to be another third that aren't officially diagnosed. We're thinking two-thirds are clinically diagnosable of our existing uh generation. So we as parents were just not prepared for this. This is something that has been part of what we were prepared for in before we came to Earth. But now that we're here, holy moly, this has been an unbelievable journey. So even if someone hasn't lost someone to suicide, they are all swimming in this space called helping their children's mental health at a degree that we've never seen before in the history of mankind. What would you what advice would you give to parents regarding how they can assist and take greater stewardship over the mental health of their children?

SPEAKER_02 8:10

I think it's it's just having those real conversations, like get used to feeling uncomfortable.

SPEAKER_00 8:17

How does that look? Like, so someone who's like I come from a family that talks very openly, but a lot of others don't.

SPEAKER_02 8:21

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 8:22

Like, how does that look?

SPEAKER_02 8:23

It it really is. I we've got really honest. Like, how are you feeling? Tell me what you're feeling. Are you struggling with specific things? Um, just being honest about it. And over time we have learned that, and it's through therapy, you know. We I'm a big advocate for therapy, medication sometimes.

SPEAKER_01 8:45

Sure.

SPEAKER_02 8:46

Um, you know, I'm a poster child for depression. I've lost half my family a lot. And um I'm not afraid to say that I I do therapy. I am medicated in some ways, you know, um, to get through some of those seasons. It doesn't mean it has to be forever. Um, but it's hard. It's hard to sometimes navigate some of those feelings alone and and know that there are there are resources out there. And that's actually the best time to be able to go to therapy because you're not in crisis mode, right? When you're in crisis mode and doing therapy is you're in it and you're it's thick, right? It's heavy, it's a lot of weight, and and it's great, you know, in that time too. But it's also great when you're feeling like things are a little bit lighter and you can, you know, maybe maybe be a little bit more reflective about things in your life or yourself and learn and have tools.

Eleven Months Later: Plane Tragedy

SPEAKER_00 9:42

So yeah, I appreciate you saying that about that element. So okay, so so moving on. So you and Drew and and that was that was in 2023, and so December of 2023, Braden passed away.

SPEAKER_02 9:54

And then 11 months later, in November of 2024, uh Drew and Graham were on their way to a BYU basketball game for just a day trip, and um and that plane didn't take off. So yeah, so they passed away in November, so 11 months later.

SPEAKER_00 10:14

Yes. So that's the background. This is the story as to how you've been in this position of learning about grief and loss and gratitude and all these things at the same time. And I I really appreciate you sharing that. Well, I, you know, I'm always conscious when I'm with people, I'm always asking, okay, father, what is it that you want me to say? And I just feel this overwhelming desire to tell you how much Heather and I love you. We just think the world of you and Drew and the kids, and just so are grateful to be with you in in this space. I think um, you know, people really are well-intentioned when they say things. When Heather Heather lost her father um early in can't to cancer, a lot of people would say things to try to like smooth things over and say things like, um, he's in a better place.

SPEAKER_01 11:00

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 11:01

It was my mother who came up and said, This sucks. And she's like, Thank you.

SPEAKER_01 11:05

Yeah, thank you.

Holding Grief And Gratitude Together

SPEAKER_00 11:06

This really is horrible. And and and so, you know, um, as you were in California thinking about what you're gonna tell people, um I'm imagining there's lots of people who are gonna be hearing your message, people who haven't lost someone that they love, people who've lost many people they love, and people who are like late in the journey and early in the journey. You know, what would you when you were preparing your thoughts, did you have an audience in mind, or is it more just the collective?

SPEAKER_02 11:33

No, I think that, you know, I do have an audience in mind. Um, obviously grief is just like one of those things, but I've been, you know, thinking about Easter coming up. Yeah. Um, that season is really hard for me. Um I actually the first after we lost Braden, I was a mess during church and I walked out. I couldn't handle it because, you know, with Easter, we have Friday where, you know, have we're like Christ has been crucified, right? It's this devastation. But then we quickly jump to Sunday where it's like he's resurrected, right?

SPEAKER_00 12:14

Like that.

SPEAKER_02 12:15

Just like that. And we know the end of the story, so it's like easy to jump to that because it's like there's hope in that, there's joy in that, there's, you know, a peace and a comfort that comes from knowing the end of the story, and it all works out perfectly, right? But um I'm sitting in Saturday, you know, wow, and that's this is my Saturday, and there's a gap between um what my reality is right now and what is to come and what the promise is that God's, you know, promised us that we will live with our family again, that we'll be reunited and we'll have eternity to live with each other. Um, but right now I'm in, I'm in the silent Saturdays sometimes, you know, of and it's not silent because Heavenly Father and Jesus are there with us in it, but it feels sometimes that that grief and that hurt and that pain is so deafening, it's hard to see where that, you know, where the promise is. And and I'm just sitting in that grief.

SPEAKER_00 13:13

Yeah. I mean, even the savior when he was being crucified, he asked where Heavenly Father was.

SPEAKER_01 13:18

Absolutely.

SPEAKER_00 13:19

Why have you abandoned me? That that type of feeling. So it's something we said in our pre-call was this idea of like lots of two things are being true at the same time for you, it sounds like.

SPEAKER_02 13:28

Yes.

SPEAKER_00 13:29

Lots of of like Saturday silence and extreme miracles.

SPEAKER_02 13:33

Yes.

SPEAKER_00 13:33

Lots of lots of grief, lots of gratitude. I I was really, I was really amazed, I think, when we talked about the posts that you're making online that are reaching so many hearts are gratitude-filled. So, can you talk to us about that that paradigm of grief and gratitude, how they go together?

Small Plates: Tracking Everyday Miracles

SPEAKER_02 13:52

Oh gosh, it has been a journey to really be able to understand both. I think when you lose something so devastating, and I've lost, you know, half of my family within 11 months, it's you question like, what is my life? You know, what am I doing? What am I going to believe in? And also like the power of, and also, you know, you have to learn that there's bitter and there's also sweet. And those two are felt at the same time a lot of times. I have extreme sorrow and devastation and heartbreak every day. But then I also have like a lot of miracles and a lot of joy and a lot of gratitude in the same moment, you know? And it's such a weird paradigm to be able to hold both and honor both at the same time. It's so hard. That has been one of the hardest things that I've had to learn how to do. Um, I before my losses, I just thought there was joy, you know? And then there was times where I was sad. Um, but a lot of times I didn't have to hold both, you know, I could just experience them differently and separate. And in this, I've learned that even when there's joy, I'm missing my family. And even when I'm sad, I can still be grateful. And so holding both of those and honoring them has been a huge learning experience for me.

SPEAKER_00 15:17

Absolutely. You know, so when you're feeling those feelings of gratitude, what comes to mind? Like what are those feelings that you have for gratitude?

SPEAKER_02 15:25

Oh gosh, it is I have seen so many experiences that I am so grateful for. And you lose so much that you just start cherishing the smallest things. You know, loss makes you appreciate the mundane, it makes you appreciate the small things in life, the sunsets, the sunrises, you know, just a Sunday dinner together.

SPEAKER_00 15:48

Yeah, I'd like to I like to hear those small things that stand out to you now. Like, what are those small things that you're like, wow, I never really appreciated that before. And only because I'm curious.

Heart Rocks And Ripples Of A Life

SPEAKER_02 15:56

Yeah. So um I remember when I was younger or a young, younger person, I remember hearing Irene, um President Irene talked about writing those things down. And they were just evidences, and he called it his small plates journal. And um, that kind of stuck with me for a long time. So after Brayden died, I started seeing it was weird because I had experienced the most tragic loss of my life. Um, but I experienced the most amazing miracles as well. And so I was like, I have to remember these and remember that even in this heart, there is still God is still good. And um so I started journaling those. And I have uh miracles and evidences notes in my phone. And honestly, well, like I see them every single day. And they're not always big, you know. Sometimes they're they are, they're like huge things, but there's a lot of times where it's just like, you know, a phone call from a friend or the song, a song turns on at the most perfect time, you know, something that means something to me. Or um, and those are evidences, and I don't really believe in the word coincidences. That's the world's way of taking God out of miracles, you know? Um it's all they're always miracles, they're always meant for us. They're it's God's hand in in our life. And so I just I journal those. Um, it's you know, I one day I'll share with you, I was struggling so bad and just hearing and feeling my angels, especially Drew. To lose a spouse is is you're you lose a lot of identity and and your companionship and just somebody who reassures you and especially someone like Drew. Yeah, he was so great. And just yeah, we were just partners in crime together, you know, and I we loved each other so much. And it's just sometimes it's hard to feel that all the time. And so I was going to therapy and I was just like, Where are you? Like, help me out. Like, I'm struggling here, and um, there was a car in front of me on as I pulled into therapy, and the license plate was eternity. It's like, who on earth has a license plate that says eternity? This person does, and it just happened to be for me, you know? And um, some people may say it's a coincidence that doesn't exist in my mind. It's evidence of God and his awareness, and so that I know that I know I'm loved, you know.

SPEAKER_00 18:30

I I wonder, you know, in the next life, when we're all together again, when we're looking back at these coincidences, how many we missed. I almost wonder if the Lord, as a parent, you know, knowing that we're going through these struggles and our perception is everything with that veil.

SPEAKER_01 18:46

Yes.

SPEAKER_00 18:47

Like everything feels so permanent with the veil. But we know differently that when that veil is lifted and we look back and our eyes are open and we see all the things and wonder how overwhelming it's gonna be for us to recognize or even question like, how did we ever think it was a coincidence? Yes, because of the nature and the eternal connection between all these pieces. You know, I was so amazed by Drew when Braden passed, how he ended up spending so much time speaking and serving people in that way. Um, let's talk about that for a second. Like, what was that for him? What was that journey? And what did what was he doing with that grief in terms of returning it to serving others?

SPEAKER_02 19:25

I think that Drew was a big, he's a big feeler. You know, he feels deeply. And and for him, that was just like we have to start testifying. How can we not? We've seen the ripples of Brayden's life in so many ways, astronomical ways. It was really just incredible. And Braden um stayed on life support for three days. And honestly, like that was such a gift for us to be able to have that because it just was evidence of God's love in so many things. Um, people and the community and friends, family reaching out. And um, we got to have that time with Braden. And it really did just refocus our lives on God, on his love and the influence of one person's life.

SPEAKER_01 20:14

Right.

Recruiting Angels Through Temple Work

SPEAKER_02 20:14

Um, I think that we forget that we have so many ripples, so many ripples in this life. And one of the things that uh Phoenix Children's gave us when Braden was, you know, passing away, they gave us a pair of hearts. And um, one heart was supposed to be in his coffin and one heart stayed with us. And the immediate family got that, but we have such big families. Drew has a family of seven, I have a family of four, and um, and lots of cousins and stuff and and friends. And we started buying heart rocks, and so um that was just our way of helping people remember something tangible and small that they're loved, that they are, they matter, that it's worth it to stay, get through the hard, and that they have angels with us here and on the other side of the veil. Um, I actually have one mine in my pocket today because it doesn't, I never not have it. It's just, you know, it's just something that I brush up on it, I put my hand in my pocket, and it's just like it's there. And it just reminds me of something, a greater good that I need to be reminded of that we so easily forget. And um, and so that's how we just kind of started, you know, we put them like with strangers. We left them on our table at dinners, you know, we leave them in the temple, we we take them everywhere. And the cool thing is Drew always had a pocket full of them, and it was almost like a nervous twitch. He would like jiggle them in his pocket, but sometimes they would fall out. And um, so he had a certain seat in the temple that he would always sit in. And um, after Drew died, I was struggling with my son that. Still here, my middle child Jack. And um, I just was like, I Jack is so much like Drew. He is like 90% DNA of Drew, probably 10% me. He has dark hair, and that's probably all he has in me. So um I was just struggling, and I was sitting in Drew's seat at the temple, and I reached down and a heart rock had fallen out. This is probably like two weeks after he had.

SPEAKER_00 22:22

Is this in the celestial room?

SPEAKER_02 22:24

This was in the celestial room. And between the cushion and the armchair frame, um, I just went to reach down to grab a Kleenex and I saw the outline of the heart. And I just was like, thank you, you know? And so he he spoke so much, so much about that. That just meant so much to him and to our family. And it just became Braden's legacy and now his and Graham's legacy of just sharing that we're all loved. We have so many angels.

SPEAKER_01 22:55

Yes.

SPEAKER_02 22:56

And um, when we do people's work in the temple as proxy, we add to that army of angels. And um, I need all the the biggest army I can get to get through this life. And um, so I'm just gonna keep going, adding to that.

SPEAKER_00 23:10

I think it's interesting, and we said this before on the show, but it's something that has been one of the greatest helps in my experience is just understanding the truth that we are legitimately recruiting angels every time we free another ancestor. That's why it's so important that we do our own research. Because if we can free our ancestors, these are people who are inclined because we are theirs. Yeah. And they there is no veil for them. They're just there and they're able to do and influence things and help us, that we are able to free them to serve us and our children.

SPEAKER_01 23:36

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 23:36

And so that that focus is so important, but it shows, I mean, it's about faith because I think people hear that as a nicety. It's not a cool thing. No, it's it's oxygen.

SPEAKER_01 23:47

Yep.

“I Freaking Love You” Legacy

SPEAKER_00 23:48

And so, yes, I think, you know, especially when that journey, as you've gone through this journey, I think there's a number of angles that you're able to serve people in because there is this process of grief and grief and severe loss, right? And then there's these other elements like mental health. There's different parents who are struggling through different degrees of that with their children. And I will tell you personally, when we read about like the um plagues in our day, the last day plagues, for me, they're mental health plagues. Yeah. You know, I don't I spend most of my time when I speak to youth groups about just anxiety and depression and all the elements that are out there. And it's very uh unbelievable to me how overwhelmed this generation is with those those pieces. And so I think as as we talk about like the temple and healing, we're talking about healing about all of these things. You know, the temple is this element that heals across the board. So with uh Drew, one of the things I saw that I I know we have some t-shirts as well, is that there's a t-shirt that you guys started making. Let's talk about that. That should be.

SPEAKER_02 24:49

Yeah. So my daughter and my sister, my sister's a graphic designer, but Drew always wanted to do something to like after Brayden died, to just like help people realize like, you're not alone. Get you can get through this. Like tomorrow's a better day. There's, you know, you can do this. And um, and so that's when he used to always say, I freaking love you. You know, he used to always say, My kids are my heroes, and I freaking love you. And he would just call people and family members, friends, and just say, Hey, just call on a tell you I freaking love you. And um, and so that's what my daughter and my um sister do is that they have t-shirts and hats, and it's um just I freaking love you. And we all need to remember that we are loved and that there are people out there that love us, and and so we have lots of people that love us. We need to remember that.

SPEAKER_00 25:41

So and I love that wink to Drew in that shirt in particular. And uh the way it was explained to me was that Drew would grab and just go, I freaking love you. Just like super passion. And well, that's where Drew and I are very similar. Honestly, like I always felt connected to him in that way and just that like intensity.

unknown 25:57

Yes.

SPEAKER_02 25:58

If there was something that Drew loved, I mean, he was all in on it for sure. I mean, passion and everybody needs to have one, you know, like everyone, he wants to share it with everyone. And so yeah, he he loved that. He loved life big for sure.

SPEAKER_00 26:15

So as you're going through this process now and where you're looking to serve others, I wonder how much you think about people who are early in those grief stages. Yeah. You know, um, and I don't know relatively where you are in that process. I mean, it's in in many ways, it doesn't feel like it's been that long because it's all within the last year and a half, right?

SPEAKER_01 26:34

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 26:35

Um, so that being said, are do you see there as like distinct stages that you've passed through in this process that you talk to people who are earlier on than you? Or what is that like from your perspective as you serve people who who have lost lost loved ones?

Early Grief And Choosing Forward

SPEAKER_02 26:50

I think in those early days, you just are so numb and in shock that it's hard to like see, it's really hard to even survive. I mean, there's times where I actually don't even go to the grocery store very much because I it's just overwhelming. It's funny how some of those simple things, you know, affect you. Um but I chose early on and I chose with Drew after Brayden passed away that we were gonna not let the grief succumb to something, you know, um ugly and take over. And we still wanted to find the good and find joy in life. And um it really is about just making one choice after another. And I think that once putting one foot in front of the other, making one choice to look at the good. Um, and that's just what this gospel is all about is just choosing every single day to do a little better, look for the good and wanting something better. Um that's what that, that's what this life is all about. And that's what God wants. He doesn't expect perfection, he doesn't expect us to, you know, live this picture perfect life because he knows it's not, you know, and he sent us here with that. And I think he has that compassion and love, and um he he knows and he's like, I'm gonna carry you through it, but it's just one choice after one choice, and that's how I've gotten through it. I think the first week that Drew died, I didn't know how I was gonna get into bed again without, you know, alone, alone and without Drew. You know, just like how it's just something so simple, it's so foreign to me. And and here I am, you know, over a year I've done it. And I look back and I'm like, I'm so proud of myself. And it's not like I really said, you know, I'm gonna do this and I'm gonna, it's really just like every single day is I can do this. I can do this, and I'm gonna do it.

SPEAKER_00 28:51

Where does that come from? That that like I can do it.

SPEAKER_02 28:55

Um, you know, I just know I've it's I've never struggled with knowing that God is real. I've always believed that. Um, and maybe that's like a spiritual gift that I was sent with. Um, but I have questioned things like why, what is my role now? What am I supposed to do? What am I gonna believe in? But um, God is very real to me. And I am very, you know, I'm a product of my mom and dad. They're both converts, and they chose the gospel and they've seen the other side, and they they have testified that this is a better life, it's just believing in God and He loves us.

Confidence In Christ, One Choice At A Time

SPEAKER_00 29:38

So that confidence in Christ is what that comes from. Yeah. That I can do it is what I'm hearing you say. And it's just these, so it sounds like it's just a lot of these really from the outside, prior to this experience, seemingly um routine decisions are no longer routine. Yeah. Because everything just goes completely upside down. And you're just saying how it's one decision at a time just to keep moving forward. But for being looking forward looks like getting in bad.

SPEAKER_02 30:05

And it's not always easy. You know, there are times and days where I'm like, I'd rather be angry and bitter and mad that I'm here and and and then I always at the end of the night, I try to pull up my evidences and miracles notes. And I think God is still good. He has shown me that, he has shown up for me in that. I'm gonna continue trusting that. And that confidence, you know, that's where it comes from.

SPEAKER_00 30:33

So that confidence gets reassured through those notes. And what did you call them again?

SPEAKER_02 30:36

Yeah, evidences and miracles.

SPEAKER_00 30:37

That's my You referred it to it earlier. So you started that after Braden passed away.

SPEAKER_02 30:41

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 30:42

And so you've been keeping track since then. Is that something you do like on a regular basis? Is this like how vital is this to you? It seems like it's really important.

SPEAKER_02 30:48

It's vital to me. It's just because it's like it's so easy in grief to get, you know, to get drowning in that. Um, grief is can be ugly and devastating and bitter and angry. And I didn't ever want that for my family. And so I've made a conscious choice to try to find the good. And that's one way I do that. And it started out almost daily. It's like you said, like the angels, I'm sure they're like trying 3,000 times, and we see three of those evidences, right? And I've told you before, Braden was never good at keeping secrets. And I'm sure he's high-fiving all of his buddies, his angel buddies, you know, when we're finally like, he's like, They saw one. They saw it finally. Finally. Yeah, like, gosh, it took them forever, you know? And um, you know, Drew and I talked about that all the time. You know, I think that they're so intertwined in our lives. We just only see a portion of them because we're so busy and we don't always see all that. But um, yeah, I think that those are the evidences, and I see them, they start out almost every day. I was writing in there every single day. Even the hardest, in the thickest part early on in my grief, I started that and I would put something every single day. And now it's weekly or a couple of times a week, but I am committed to putting that in there because that's something that I want to remember. I want my kids to remember. Generationally, I want them to remember. Those are my small plates.

SPEAKER_00 32:22

Yeah. And they are an anchor to the truth that again, it's it's these two things are true at the same time. I'm very conscious when I'm talking about these things to not over-emphasize like all these great things.

SPEAKER_01 32:35

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 32:36

Because all these things are happening and massive tragedy, loss, and pain. And I think that's to what I'm learning from you, Tanya, is just how the understanding both of those pillars simultaneously, how that brings us closer to Christ at the end and knowing that we will eventually get to that place. But until then, it's Saturday.

SPEAKER_01 32:54

Yeah.

Notes That Pull You Back To Hope

SPEAKER_00 32:54

We're in that Saturday. I worked um for years, as you know, as a physical therapist. And I spent almost all my day with people in the last stages of life. Um, and it was so interesting because I think we just, especially when we're younger, you know, you always hear like the young and dumb, we're all out there like just thinking we're gonna live forever and have this wonderful life forever. Yeah. But I was very early introduced to this stage of life where loss was synonymous with living and um working with different individuals at different times through different challenges. And just one one gentleman in particular, uh, his name is David. He was probably in his 90s, 20 years ago. Um, and he wasn't doing great then. So he's he's listening right now in real time with us. And um, I remember he he lost his wife after all these years, and he he turned to me after he trusted me, after he realized I was all in with him. And he just said, you know, he goes, I want to tell you what it's like. You know, I said, What's that to lose your sweetheart? He goes, It's like this giant hole. And this is like this hole in your soul that if you're not careful, you fall in. He goes, and he just started sobbing. And I was just like, Well, what did you do? And he goes, I honestly can't tell you. Like he didn't have the language for it, but he was a believer in Christ, and I'm sure and he was a very naturally grateful individual. So it's powerful to think about how gratitude is so much more than just like a fluffy word. It's it's like gravity in the sense that it's like this law of nature that is there. And if we can choose to like understand how to leverage it for our benefit, it's it becomes an anchor to Christ. And reminds me of something I heard recently from someone very powerful who just said, you know, I believe that the keys of of finding joy in this life in the face of all these things is a combination of gratitude, growing, and giving.

SPEAKER_01 34:42

I love that.

SPEAKER_00 34:43

And so I Tanya, I can see where gratitude has been your foundational anchor. Growth has happened, whether you've wanted it or not. It's just been thrust upon you, and you're you're you're growing, and now you're talking to others about giving. Yeah. So, what do you hope to give others? What do you hope to give as you start to open your mouth and and share your story?

SPEAKER_02 35:06

I think that I hope that people will see that you can get through. This is hard. It is hard. It's hard to even. I I always say I'm like just above drowning a lot of times. And sometimes I'm drowning. Um but there is so much good and power in angels and prayers and people, and God's hand is evident in so much of our life. Um, the temple for me has been my modern day Liahona. It has been the thing that helps me navigate, it helps me have the strength, it helps me find the center of where I need to go to be able to receive personal revelation. Um, and it's been life-changing for me.

The Temple As A Modern Liahona

SPEAKER_00 35:55

Yeah, talk to me about that if you don't mind. I mean, so the temple in the last few years for you has been your modern day, Liahona. And so you receive revelation from it. Um could you just tell me a little bit more about that from your perspective? I think that you have such a the veil is so thin for you because of the hardship. So, what how has your temple worship shifted as a result in the last few years?

SPEAKER_02 36:19

Well, I can admit that I wasn't, you know, as regular. I go weekly now. Um, that has changed so much since Braden passed away. Drew actually would go almost daily. And I would tease him because daily after Braden passed away. After Brayden went passed away, he was struggling a lot and just understanding the whys and sure, needing to feel Braden, you know, and he knew that that was pretty much guaranteed Brayden time.

SPEAKER_01 36:45

Okay.

SPEAKER_02 36:45

Um, and so he would go and try to like work through he struggled like getting back to work and stuff like that. And um just wanted to have a find a better purpose in life, you know, some just not the grind of every day, but find God in all of that. And so um almost daily, so you know, the temple is closed, you know, Sunday and Monday. And so I would tell him, like, go bang on the door Tuesday morning because you got to get there. And it really was like his sacred grove, his personal sacred grove was at the temple. And he could feel it. I could feel it for him, you know, and I could see it just the angst, the the grief, the heartache just would just inch up over him through Sunday and and Monday when the temple was closed.

SPEAKER_00 37:34

You could see that difference.

Weekly Worship And Family Names

SPEAKER_02 37:36

It was, yeah, it was so apparent. And I felt that too, you know. If I if I go at the beginning of the week and by the end of the week, I feel like, you know, it's kind of been a while. I haven't been and I need to get there. Um and there's power in attending. Um, my temple attendance has changed. One of the things that I have done is I have studied a lot about family names and my own family names and Drew's family names. And so um I don't go without a family name because those are my people. Right. Um, and those are my army that I have, you know, talked about. And um, if there are lots of people out there that, you know, need that work done, but those people especially are my people. And so I am going to help gather Israel that way and bring those people closer and thin that veil as thin as I can get, you know, because I want to feel that.

SPEAKER_00 38:34

You know, one of the powerful things about your words, Tanya, just if I can say something as a reflection to you, is the way that you the way that you speak about it now, just from the place that you're speaking from, has an exponential impact in a way I don't think you realize. So just to be aware.

SPEAKER_01 38:57

Thank you.

SPEAKER_00 38:58

Um, and to give you some encouragement in that regard because it's it's like going to a this is a really ugly example, but it's the only one that comes to mind. It's like going to one of my business conferences that I spend time going to, and you you hear someone jump on stage and they're all motivational and stuff, and they say all these things. And they might even say it with like enthusiasm and like all the right pizzazz and all these things, and and it might be positive and impactful. But then you have someone who stands up who has really learned about a concept. Like they've they've experienced mass, and by the way, I've never met a successful business leader who hasn't experienced massive business failure. So they talk about their failures, they talk about their successes, and you see yourself in them, but then you see something elevated that's hopeful and inspiring because they've accomplished andor are doing the thing that you would want to do, which is which is what you do. When you come from that place, when you're talking about these words that you're saying, I just don't want you to ever minimize how powerful they are, because for me, uh it's just hitting so differently than if I'd heard some anyone else say this.

SPEAKER_02 40:04

So um that means a lot to me. I appreciate that.

SPEAKER_00 40:07

Yeah, and I and I I you know, obviously, this is this is just a recording of a of a natural conversation, but it's true. I just feel like there's so much weight to what you're saying in a way that is inspiring me. I hear the temple from you from a place of like, this is real. Like there's no doubt because of the impact, you saw that with with Drew. You saw how he was physically and emotionally different. And it reminds me of that quote of the temple, how it's like um fresh water. Have you heard that before?

SPEAKER_01 40:37

Yes.

SPEAKER_00 40:37

Yeah, it's that whole concept of like if we're boats and we get these barnacles, and it's the barnacles are the challenges and the sufferings of life and they attach to our hull. Um, you know, ships that go into fresh water, they just naturally fall off by spending time in the fresh water. And so the that fresh celestial water that we get to go spend time in is something that you you can tell on a different level.

SPEAKER_01 40:58

Yeah.

Making Meaning And Giving Back

SPEAKER_00 40:58

And again, I think that sounds different coming from you, who's someone who's experiencing it versus someone who's just trying to be, who's nervously trying to consult someone else. Yeah. And just saying words that are there when you say it, it's coming from knowledge.

SPEAKER_02 41:10

Yeah, for sure. But it's also that's what they're experiencing right now, and you got to hold space for that as well. And and there's some some compassion and empathy there for that. And yeah, you know, it's it's their journey, it's our we each have a story. When it becomes personal, personal, you do feel that passion for it, you know. And I think that that's why we're sent here though, is to be able to have that voice, you know, to help others. It's I hate that I've gone through what I've gone through because it's awful, you know. But I'm so grateful for what I've learned and how it has helped me see compassion and empathy for others, you know. Life is hard.

SPEAKER_00 41:55

Have you ever read Man's Um Search for Meaning?

SPEAKER_02 41:58

No, I don't know that book. Yeah, I haven't read it.

SPEAKER_00 42:00

Neither have I. And I'm almost nauseated by how many times it gets quoted or how many quotes I know, but I just recently read a quote about how suffering um transforms when we find purpose in it, in those types of things. Now we're talking about family history. You're being recorded, right? Like this is out there, and um your great-great-grandkids are gonna see this. So, what would you want them to know? What would you want them to know?

SPEAKER_02 42:27

I want them to know that God is good, even in the heart. He is most definitely good in the heart. He loves us and that we are always his, and that he is going to rescue us every single time. And I have been rescued. I know that Brayden and Graham and Drew have been rescued. I know that Hallie and Jack have been rescued, and he'll continue to rescue us. And that worth never changes for him, that love never changes, and I'm so grateful for that.

SPEAKER_00 43:04

There's so much more meaning in that piece of the way that you're connecting. And I'm sure you experienced that when you went to the BYU summit that you're speaking at, where you're with other people.

SPEAKER_01 43:12

Absolutely.

Final Reflections And Closing

SPEAKER_00 43:14

And I just know, I just know you. Like there's no one who can do it the way that you're going to do it for so many others. So um, yeah, I'm just so grateful for you, Tanya, and for what you're saying and doing. And inspired isn't even like the right word. But it's it's just you've changed my perspective on life in a way that's that's permanent for me by just being with you. And um, I can't thank you enough for being on the show. Thank you so much for coming down and talking with us.

SPEAKER_02 43:41

Oh gosh, it's been an honor.

SPEAKER_00 43:42

Thanks again for listening to today's episode of Temple Bound. If you enjoyed today's show, make sure to join us over on Instagram at Temple Bound Podcast to receive additional information as well as previews of our upcoming episodes. See you over there.